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Tråd: Fokus: Tyrkia - høyt politisk spill med NATO og kurderne - Europa

  1. #961
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    Sv: Fokus: Tyrkia - høyt politisk spill med NATO og kurderne - Europa

    Sitat Opprinnelig skrevet av Znuddel Vis post
    Skogbranndiplomatiet.

    Hellas og Tyrkia treng katastrofar for å snakke saman, men dei greske skogbrannane er ikkje nok.

    https://www.bt.no/btmeninger/komment...box=1532577814



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    Da flyr Tyrkiske brannfly til Sverige for å løse av Italienske som flyr ned til Hellas...


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    Minsk, det nye Utopia

  2. #962
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    Sv: Fokus: Tyrkia - høyt politisk spill med NATO og kurderne - Europa

    USA har innført sanksjoner mot justisministeren og innenriksministeren i Tyrkia. En oppsummering:

    http://www.middleeasteye.net/news/ho...rkey-792162711


    Senatet har (som ventet) vedtatt å stoppe salg av F-35 til Tyrkia, til en rapport har blitt produsert om forholdet mellom Tyrkia og USA. Rapporten må foreligge iløpet av 90 dager.

    https://about.bgov.com/blog/senate-c...-headed-trump/

    Det blir interessant å se om disse tiltakene påvirker Erdogan. Hvis han ikke endrer kurs så kan Tyrkia bli ytterligere distansert fra Vesten, og i verste fall vil til og med NATO-medlemsskapet til Tyrkia kunne stå i fare. Ting tyder imidlertid på at Erdogan har skjønt at han har gått for langt og er villig til å forhandle:

    https://www.reuters.com/article/us-t...-idUSKBN1KO0JE

  3. #963
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    Sv: Fokus: Tyrkia - høyt politisk spill med NATO og kurderne - Europa

    https://www.dailysabah.com/columns/r...pian-backstory

    Daily Sabah er pro Erdogan. Men med relativ ofte kvalitet i det dem skriver. Det gjelder deres mann i Washington.

    Kort fortalt

    Det er mange kokker som ikke bruker samme resept på Amerikansk side.
    Trump tror at uformelt korridorsnakk med Erdogan er formelle forhandlinger.
    Det kommer å ordne seg.

    Tyrkia har svart på de Amerikanske sanksjonene med tilsvarende tannløse mot USAs justisminister og innenriksminister. Så langt er disse sanksjoner et politisk spill da ingen av de 4 har noen som helst tilganger som er berørt. Opposisjonen bortsett fra HDP gir regjeringen sterk støtte.

    PS. Kanskje kommer det straffetoll mot tyrkiske moreller. Moreller er en viktig næring i deler av Michigan, der GOP håper på å kunne vinne en senator i mellomvalget.

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    Minsk, det nye Utopia

  4. #964
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    Sv: Fokus: Tyrkia - høyt politisk spill med NATO og kurderne - Europa

    Møtet mellom Tyrkia og USA klarte ikke å løse floken med de amerikanske gislene i Tyrkia:


    https://www.aa.com.tr/en/americas/us...return/1227046


    Trump dobler metall-tariffene mot Tyrkia nå i dag:

    https://www.cnbc.com/2018/08/10/turk...-convert-.html


    Dette ser ikke bra ut.

  5. #965
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    Sv: Fokus: Tyrkia - høyt politisk spill med NATO og kurderne - Europa

    En interessant men også bekymringsfull artikkel i DW:


    https://www.dw.com/en/purged-turkish...ion/a-44985353


    Noen vil kanskje peke på at dette er bare en side av denne saken, og at denne tidligere offiseren naturligvis vil hevde sin uskyld. På den annen side: Hvis han virkelig hadde hadde hatt kontakt med Gulen, PKK eller andre "terrorister" så ville han vel neppe reist tilbake til Tyrkia!

    NATO ser ut til å være svært upopulært i Tyrkia for tiden...

  6. #966
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    Sv: Fokus: Tyrkia - høyt politisk spill med NATO og kurderne - Europa

    Å se Trump aksjonere mot Tyrkia blir litt som å se blind høne finne korn. Det er på sin plass å se på Erdogan og det tyrkiske regimet, men handlemåte og begrunnelse blir litt hodeløst. Skulle nesten tro han ikke hadde peiling på diplomati.....
    TTTF - Trykk, Tal, Tenk, F***!

  7. #967
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    Sv: Fokus: Tyrkia - høyt politisk spill med NATO og kurderne - Europa

    Dette er ikke noe problem for 10%-Recep, nå kan han skylde på Trump og USA.

    Regner med at EU må ta regningen.
    Død ved Kølle!
    Bla bla... Hybrid warfare is easy

  8. #968
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    Sv: Fokus: Tyrkia - høyt politisk spill med NATO og kurderne - Europa

    Tyrkisk økonomi er i en veldig sårbar posisjon; nå som liren har falt som en stein vil en se at inflasjonen ytterligere vil fly igjennom taket da mye råvarer og ferdigvarer er importert og betales gjerne i EUR/USD.

    https://www.cnbc.com/2018/08/13/turk...d-tariffs.html

    What went wrong for Turkey? Its economy is 'in the midst of a perfect storm'


    • Turkey has in recent years been one of the fastest-growing economies in the world, but its impressive growth numbers were fueled by foreign-currency debt.
    • The country's borrowing resulted in deficits in both its fiscal and current accounts, and Turkey doesn't have large enough reserves to rescue the economy when things go wrong, experts say.
    • Making the situation worse for Turkey is President Recep Tayyip Erdogan's preference to keep interest rates low even though inflation is more than three times the central bank's target.




  9. #969
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    Sv: Fokus: Tyrkia - høyt politisk spill med NATO og kurderne - Europa

    Siste nytt:

    Trump har signert "defence spending bill" som spesifiserer at salg av F-35 til Tyrkia skal stoppes i 90 dager til en rapport om Tyrkia og F-35 har blitt utarbeidet:

    It includes an amendment prohibiting sales to Turkey of the F-35 Joint Strike Fighter jets until the Pentagon issues a report on Turkish-American relations in 90 days.
    The report is expected to include an assessment of Turkey's participation in the F-35 program as well as the risks that would be posed by the country's purchase of the Russian S-400 missile defense system.
    http://www.hurriyetdailynews.com/tru...-turkey-135763

    Ifølge Bloomberg sier Bolton at det er ingenting å forhandle om før Tyrkia har frigitt Brunson:

    https://www.bloomberg.com/news/artic...assador-to-u-s


    Erdogan sier Tyrkia skal boikotte elektroniske artikler fra USA, inkludert Iphone:

    https://www.cnbc.com/2018/08/14/erdo...ing-apple.html


    Dette kommer nok til å bli verre før det (forhåpentligvis!) blir bedre igjen. Det synes nokså klart at kombinasjonen Erdogan-Trump ikke er helt god.

  10. #970
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    Sv: Fokus: Tyrkia - høyt politisk spill med NATO og kurderne - Europa

    Academy Securities skrev dette tidligere i sommer:

    For the last six months, Academy has surveyed its Geopolitical Intelligence Group (GIG), comprised of ten retired admirals and generals, on the rising tensions with Turkey. Consistently, our GIG has identified this deteriorating relationship as a significant foreign policy concern. Additionally, the GIG sees the potential for Turkey to leave NATO by years end as likely.
    http://www.academysecurities.com/turkey-nato/

    Ulv, ulv? Eller er det virkelig så alvorlig nå?

  11. #971
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    nyhetsstrømmen til NRK sier Tyrkia løslater greske soldater. Men de sier ikke hvor de 1. mars ble plukket opp.
    I must kill all free radicals

  12. #972
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    Sv: Fokus: Tyrkia - høyt politisk spill med NATO og kurderne - Europa

    Dagens nyheter vedrørende forholdet mellom Tyrkia og USA:

    Turkey has announced increased tariffs on U.S. products, raising duties on American booze to 140 percent, cars to 120 percent and tobacco to 60 percent.

    The government claims it is responding to a "deliberate attack" by the U.S. on Turkey's economy, which is in the midst of a currency crisis that economists say was triggered by flawed monetary policy.

    Tariffs on rice, cosmetics and coal will also be doubled, and Turkish President Recep Erdogan has urged his citizens to boycott U.S. electronic goods.
    https://www.cnbc.com/2018/08/15/turk...diplomacy.html

    Hva blir Trumps svar til dette?

  13. #973
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    Sv: Fokus: Tyrkia - høyt politisk spill med NATO og kurderne - Europa

    Oped in Washington post argumenterer for at Tyrkia må ut av NATO:


    After a U.S.-based energy firm began drilling in Cyprus’s waters in September 2011, Turkish Minister Egemen Bagis warned, “This is what we have the navy for. We have trained our marines for this; we have equipped the navy for this. All options are on the table; anything can be done.” More recently, Erdogan threatened U.S. forces in Syria with an “Ottoman slap.” Both Dogu Perincek, an intellectual godfather of the Turkish military, and Adnan Tanriverdi, Erdogan’s military counselor, are both fiercely anti-NATO.

    Writing in the New York Times, Erdogan himself warned that continued “disrespect will require us to start looking for new friends and allies,” an unsubtle threat that he might pivot toward Russia. But, in many ways, he already has. Erdogan has made it clear that he aims to purchase Russian S-400 missiles, which, if integrated into Turkish air-defense systems, might compromise NATO air-defense secrets to Russian engineers. Those counseling a softer line point out that Erdogan’s strategy is, in part, transactional. This is true, but that is all the more reason to second-guess Turkey’s role in collective defense. After all, when a crisis erupts, NATO members must rally together, not engage in bidding wars with Washington and Moscow over who deserves its loyalty.

    Indeed, the real danger to NATO is not that Turkey will withdraw or pivot to Russia, but rather that it remains inside. Because NATO decisions are consensual, Turkey can play the proverbial Trojan Horse to filibuster any action when crisis looms.

    It is true there is no clear mechanism to expel NATO members – but NATO’s survival nonetheless requires purging Turkey. The West should call Erdogan’s bluff.

    https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/...=.f5cf63acda76

    Jeg er fortsatt usikker -- stemmer premissene til Rubin?

  14. #974
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    Sv: Fokus: Tyrkia - høyt politisk spill med NATO og kurderne - Europa

    Tyrkia lar tysk journalist forlate Tyrkia:

    https://www.thelocal.de/20180820/imp...rial-continues

    Greske soldater som har vært holdt fanget i flere måneder ble sluppet fri og er nå tilbake i Hellas:

    https://abcnews.go.com/International...diers-57172073

    Prominent medlem ("honorary chair") av Amnesty International har blitt løslatt:

    https://www.politico.eu/article/turk...r-taner-kilic/

    Brunson:

    President Donald Trump on Monday ruled out making any concessions to Turkey to gain the freedom of a detained American pastor and said he was not concerned that retaliatory tariffs he imposed will have a ripple effect and hurt the European economy.

    Trump, speaking to Reuters in an Oval Office interview, said he thought he had a deal with Turkish President Recep Tayyip Erdogan when he helped persuade Israel to free a detained Turkish citizen.

    He had thought Erdogan would then release pastor Andrew Brunson.

    "I think it's very sad what Turkey is doing. I think they're making a terrible mistake. There will be no concessions," he said.
    https://www.cnbc.com/2018/08/20/trum...us-pastor.html

    Har Trump tabbet seg ut? Eller prøver Tyrkia å "lure" USA for å få mest mulig ut av Brunson? Vanskelig å si..

    Tyrkias krav:

    The Trump administration rejected a proposal from the Turkish government that would free a detained American pastor in exchange for relief of one of its largest banks, The Wall Street Journal reported.
    The report, which cites a senior White House official, said Turkey asked the U.S. to drop an ongoing investigation into Halkbank, one of the biggest state-owned Turkish banks. Halkbank faces major fines for allegedly violating U.S. sanctions on Iran.

    In exchange, the Turkish government would release Andrew Brunson, an American pastor who has been detained in Turkey since 2016. Turkey accused Brunson of spying and trying to overthrow the government after a failed coup that year. President Donald Trump said Friday the charges against Brunson were "phony," adding "he is not a spy."
    https://www.cnbc.com/2018/08/20/us-r...s-release.html

  15. #975
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    Sv: Fokus: Tyrkia - høyt politisk spill med NATO og kurderne - Europa

    Det over Brunson = Det man gjør for å få hjelp fra EU.

    Det som handler om USA-Brunson.

    Lord, stakkars mann.
    Død ved Kølle!
    Bla bla... Hybrid warfare is easy

  16. #976
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    Sv: Fokus: Tyrkia - høyt politisk spill med NATO og kurderne - Europa

    Det Tyrkia gjør er jo jevngodt med å innrømme at de har hjulpet Iran.

    Spark osmanerne ut av NATO, sier nå jeg, og la dem seile sin egen sjø. Ja, man har ønsket å holde dem inne for å begrense russisk bevegelsesfrihet fra Svartehavet til Middelhavet, og generelt passe på NATOs sørøstflanke. Men russerne har baser i Syria, og samarbeider fint med tyrkerne når begge parter ønsker det, så det spørs om det ikke koster mer enn det smaker å ha dem inne. Og la dem for all del ikke slippe inn i EU.
    Those who beat their swords into plowshares will plow for those who don't.

  17. #977
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    Sv: Fokus: Tyrkia - høyt politisk spill med NATO og kurderne - Europa

    Litt apropos, Hellas og Israel øver sammen: https://www.jpost.com/Israel-News/Gr...medium=twitter
    Ingen av landene er direkte superentusiastiske over Erdogan & co.
    Those who beat their swords into plowshares will plow for those who don't.

  18. #978
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    Sv: Fokus: Tyrkia - høyt politisk spill med NATO og kurderne - Europa

    På sikt så er kanskje ikke Russland hovedproblemet, men Kina -- hvis Tyrkia forlater NATO og den "vestlige" sfære så tror jeg det er en stor risiko for at Kina kommer til å gi Erdogan et tilbud han ikke kan avslå... Og da får Europa plutselig Kina rett ved inngangsdøra (i tillegg til Russland).

    1. Kineserne tenker langsiktig.

    2. Kina vil naturligvis ikke drømme om å blande seg inn i andre lands anliggender -- medmindre andre land "blander seg inn" i Kinas anliggender naturligvis.....

  19. #979
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    Sv: Fokus: Tyrkia - høyt politisk spill med NATO og kurderne - Europa

    By Abdullah Bozkurt
    A Russian-Iranian proxy group led by neo-nationalist leader Doğu Perinçek, a close ally of Turkey’s Islamist President Recep Tayyip Erdoğan, has been busy undermining the NATO alliance from within as a Trojan horse following a secret deal between the two politicians that paved the way for convicted officers to not only return to their posts but also get promoted to key positions in the alliance’s second largest army.

    Two incidents that took place at NATO’s Joint Warfare Centre (JWC) in Stavanger, Norway, in November 2017 during the Trident Javelin 2017 exercise — which aimed at testing and enhancing NATO command and control in several locations across Europe — exposed the dangerous spillover from the Erdoğan government’s unprecedented purge of Turkish military officers in large numbers. The computer-assisted exercise, which took place between Nov. 6 and 17, 2017 in Stavanger involved a war game called “Skolkan 3” and was based on NATO’s Article V collective defense provision. The drill featured a scenario of a military campaign to restore the territorial integrity of Norway. It also envisaged assistance to nations on the Baltic Sea to re-establish security and stability in the wake of an increasing number of hybrid and cyber-attacks.

    Although Norway’s JWC was in charge of the war game, the Supreme Headquarters Allied Powers Europe (SHAPE) was involved at the strategic level and the Allied Joint Force Command Brunssum (JFCBS) in the Netherlands played its part at the operational level. At the tactical level, the NATO Land Command (LANDCOM) in Turkey’s western province of Izmir — which had already suffered a blow from a Turkish military purge — joined the exercise. NATO Maritime Command (MARCOM) in Northwood, UK, and NATO Air Command (AIRCOM) in Ramstein, Germany, provided other assets at tactical levels.

    When the drills were nearing an end, a scandal erupted over the targeting of both Erdoğan and the founder of the Turkish Republic, Atatürk, which prompted the overreacting Turkish government to quit the drill and recall 41 officers deployed to Norway. It was reported that a civilian contracted by the Norwegian military in Brunssum in the Netherlands opened a fake account in the name of the Turkish president on NATO’s internal social media network. The Turkish president was pictured as collaborating with an enemy – which, incidentally, is not entirely false given how Erdoğan’s rhetoric and actions have served the interests of the anti-NATO bloc in recent years.

    The simulation foresaw Turkey purchasing missiles from the Skolkan Federation (a made-up name for Russia) with which NATO was at war during the digital drills. Remember how Turkey vowed to purchase S-400 long-range missiles from Russia and even dared to replace the stalled F-35 fighter jets with Russian bombers. In the drill, it was also reported that Erdoğan and Putin met after a special message was sent from hostile forces. By the way, let’s not forget that another fake account was also opened on the name of US President Donald Trump in the same simulation.

    A technician found a picture of an Atatürk statue on the Internet and used it in the “Hostile Leaders Biographies” section of the computerized exercise in Stavanger. Although in both cases NATO moved quickly to dismiss these people, and NATO Secretary-General Jens Stoltenberg and Norwegian officials scrambled to apologize to Turkey over the incident, Erdoğan capitalized on the scandal to ratchet up his anti-NATO narrative and fuel xenophobia instead of downplaying it and calming the tension. He took up the issue at public rallies to rant and escalate the matter to the point of recalling Turkish officers in what many saw as a tempest in a teapot. He branded Stoltenberg’s apology as “halfhearted” and implied it was intended as a hush-up.

    I have talked to several sources on what to make of the incident, and all of them expressed serious doubts over the possibility of such an incident taking place at highly secure NATO bases without a deliberate plot to create an excuse for the Turkish president and his allies, who have been viciously campaigning against Western and NATO allies in recent years. Although NATO was about the wrap up the digital drill in Norway, the Erdoğan government did not wait for its completion to handle the matter discreetly. As if they were waiting for such a scandal, the neo-nationalist Aydınlık daily, owned by the Perinçek gang, ran a headline screaming, “Let’s exit from NATO,” while Yeni Şafak, the pro-Erdoğan Islamist flagship daily owned by Iranian hacks, published a front-page headline declaring that “NATO is an enemy for us [Turkey].”

    Moreover, the Erdoğan government used the scandal to add further demands of NATO on issues that were not at all related to addressing the incident. For example, Ankara repeated its demand for the extradition of asylum-seeking Turkish officers who were deployed to NATO posts during the false flag coup bid of 2016 but refused to return for fear of unjust imprisonment. Even though the responsibility for processing asylum applications lies squarely with member states and NATO has nothing to do with that, Turkey used the opportunity to put pressure on allies with a view of bringing back NATO officers to face ill-treatment and torture in Turkish prisons and detention centers, as many have had to endure.

    Both Turkish Foreign Minister Mevlüt Çavuşoğlu and then-European Union Affairs Minister Ömer Celik said the dismissal of the two people was not enough and demanded that more heads roll in the chain of command. That included the prosecution of Italian Chief of Staff Gen. Salvatore Farina, who was commander of JFC Brunssum and the NATO Response Force 2018 during the drills. The Turks also dared to ask NATO to drop its critical approach to Turkey in the wake of an unprecedented purge in the Turkish military that inflicted a huge toll on pro-NATO officers who were dismissed en masse on dubious charges. The Ankara Chief Public Prosecutor’s Office even launched a criminal investigation into the incident under case file No. 2017/191238, suggesting that Erdoğan is bent on abusing the criminal justice system to bolster anti-NATO sentiment in Turkey. Deputy Chief Prosecutor Gürhan Özok, who has been one of Erdoğan’s attack dogs, is leading the ongoing investigation in the cybercrimes unit.

    Casting further doubt on the credibility of the Erdoğan government’s motivations is the identity of a 40-year old Turkish officer who was reported to have detected the scandal in the secure NATO communications system. Her name is Ebru Nilhan Bozkurt, a Navy lieutenant commander who was convicted and sentenced to five years, 10 months by the Istanbul 11th High Criminal Court for possessing classified documents without authorization on Aug. 2, 2102. She was among 56 civilian and military members who were indicted on Feb. 10, 2011, by Istanbul prosecutor Fikret Seçen on several counts including military espionage, blackmail, prostitution and possessing state secrets. Although the indictment sought 17 years in prison for her, she was not arrested, but the case against her proceeded while she was free on her own recognizance. When her 2012 conviction in the lower court was upheld by the 9th Chamber of the Supreme Court of Appeals on Dec. 7, 2013, Bozkurt fled Turkey to escape an arrest warrant issued for the execution of her sentence.

    Bozkurt graduated from the Navy War School in 1998 and served as a lieutenant in a Navy Maritime Patrol Aircraft project called Meltem-2, an important asset for NATO to patrol the southern flank bordering Russia. Her name was discovered in documents obtained from retired Col. Ibrahim Sezer, the number one suspect in the case, during the execution of a search warrant on Sezer’s home. The folder prepared by Bozkurt included six secretly recorded videotapes of Turkish military aircraft while parked in a hangar. The text included in the same folder stated that “all responsible people in the field should videotape important places on their bases by the end of June 2010 and ship them to me [Sezer] via courier, and do not forget to attach explanatory notes on the footage.”

    Although Sezer was retired and was not the commanding officer, Bozkurt had her people shoot secret videos of both the exterior and the interior of fighter jets, cargo planes, repair facilities and the tarmac and sent them to Sezer by courier. She also asked her handler for advanced equipment to get better-quality videos because what she used was not capable of getting clear shots. When the prosecutor asked the Office of the Chief of General Staff about the videos and documents, the response was that they would damage Turkey’s national security if they were revealed to the public or passed to enemies.

    After Erdoğan’s amnesty and secret deal with the neo-nationalists, Bozkurt was allowed to return to duty in the military as a lieutenant and was assigned to the Cengiz Topel Naval Air Station in Kocaeli province on the western side of Istanbul. She was later promoted to head of the department for an administrative and coordination unit in the General Secretariat of the Turkish Naval Command and was responsible for radar, defense systems and marine and submarine combat capabilities. In the meantime, the panel of judges at the Istanbul 11th High Criminal Court — presiding judge Metin Özçelik, judge Birol Bilen and judge Mehmet Ekinci – that presided over her trial were all sacked by the Erdoğan government and were later thrown in jail on fabricated charges.

    Bozkurt claimed that she identified user “RTErdoğan” in a Twitter-like chat program on the afternoon of Nov. 14, 2017, and started following it. In her testimony as a witness at the Ankara prosecutor’s office, Bozkurt remarked that she realized a negative perception was being presented about Erdoğan and Turkey and reported the user to public affairs officers Denver Applehans and Özkan Yüksel of the Allied Maritime Command (MARCOM). The user was removed from the program the next day. The use of Atatürk on the enemy leaders’ list was found out by a Turkish officer named Volkan Atayer, a procurement officer who worked at the NATO Land Command. He said he identified the picture when he was scanning his computer station on Nov. 15, 2017, at 9:05 a.m. and that the picture was removed an hour later after he informed the public affairs officer.

    Causing further speculation, in this case, is the fact that Bozkurt was personally selected for the mission in Norway by Rear Adm. Cihat Yaycı, the head of personnel for the Turkish Naval Forces. Not only was Bozkurt’s selection by Yaycı unusual given the fact that such assignments were made from the lower ranks without the involvement of higher-ups, it was also bizarre that Bozkurt decided to inform Yaycı directly about the scandal soon after she found out about it instead of going through the chain of command. The Yaycı’s background gives us some context to better understand this odd relationship between him and Bozkurt.

    Yaycı is a notorious figure in the military for leading an ad-hoc, special department called the Judicial Monitor and Scrutiny Administrative Work (ATİŞ, or Adli Takip İnceleme İdari İşlem in Turkish) that profiles officers who are marked for unlawful dismissal. He is the architect of what the Erdoğan government called “FetöMetre,” a set of criteria (reportedly 67 main criteria and 239 sub-criteria) to identify officers who would be dismissed without any effective judicial or administrative probe. Included among them, for example, are individuals who served at NATO posts, had impressive service records, scored high in competitive examinations or excelled in foreign languages. These officers were labeled as untrustworthy, traitors or terrorists by the gang of neo-nationalist and Islamist figures who are now calling the shots in the Turkish military.

    Even if the scandal in Norway during the NATO exercise was the work of lone wolfs who hate Erdoğan and Turkey, how the matter was handled by the Erdoğan government and the profile of the people involved from the Turkish military cast a long shadow over the commitment of the current Turkish regime to the alliance’s security. Turkey under Erdoğan is the weakest link in NATO and qualifies as a Trojan horse that collaborates with the enemy.
    Perhaps Erdoğan’s fake profile in NATO’s secure communications and chat system did get it right after all. (turkishminute.com)
    https://stockholmcf.org/commentary-n...-trojan-horse/

    ????

    Kan noen bekrefte at ovenstående er en vill konspirasjonsteori!?

  20. #980
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    Sv: Fokus: Tyrkia - høyt politisk spill med NATO og kurderne - Europa

    Russia’s sophisticated S-400 anti-ballistic missile defense systems will be delivered to Turkey in 2019, state arms exporter Rosoboronexport has announced, amid the latter’s feud with NATO allies over the deployment of these multibillion non-NATO systems on its soils, which have raised concern over the security of allied weaponry and radar systems.
    Rosoboronexport also said it would switch to using local currencies in deals with foreign trade partners, instead of using the dollar.
    http://www.hurriyetdailynews.com/tur...in-2019-136026

  21. #981
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    Sv: Fokus: Tyrkia - høyt politisk spill med NATO og kurderne - Europa

    Sitat Opprinnelig skrevet av loke2 Vis post
    På sikt så er kanskje ikke Russland hovedproblemet, men Kina -- hvis Tyrkia forlater NATO og den "vestlige" sfære så tror jeg det er en stor risiko for at Kina kommer til å gi Erdogan et tilbud han ikke kan avslå... Og da får Europa plutselig Kina rett ved inngangsdøra (i tillegg til Russland).

    1. Kineserne tenker langsiktig.

    2. Kina vil naturligvis ikke drømme om å blande seg inn i andre lands anliggender -- medmindre andre land "blander seg inn" i Kinas anliggender naturligvis.....
    1=Doubt.
    2. Det er vi kjent med, med mindre man har penger nok.

    Kina har sine fingre der det er plass. Tyrkia har allerede en del Kinesisk kapital.
    Men jeg tror ikke Kina kommer til å satse for mye på Erdogan. Det er ikke så mye å hente I en fallende økonomi.
    At de tar over noen havner og flyplasser kommer til å skje uansett.
    Død ved Kølle!
    Bla bla... Hybrid warfare is easy

  22. #982
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    Sv: Fokus: Tyrkia - høyt politisk spill med NATO og kurderne - Europa

    Relativt stille vedrørende forholdet Tyrkia-USA de siste dagene -- kanskje man øyner en diplomatisk løsning? Eller er Trump et al altfor opptatt med andre ting (Cohen, Manafort, Mueller, osv osv).

    Iallefall, etpar lyspunkter (for de som fortsatt håper på forbedring i forholdet):

    https://www.dailysabah.com/politics/...e-f-35-problem

    https://www.aa.com.tr/en/middle-east...manbij/1238947

    https://www.janes.com/article/82515/...-collaboration

    På den annen side:

    http://www.atlanticcouncil.org/blogs...re-of-the-f-35

    The bilateral tensions may soon get worse. Senate appropriators have also secured an amendment to the Fiscal Year 2019 State, Foreign Operations, and Related Programs Appropriations Act. US Senator Chris Van Hollen’s F-35 amendment prohibits using funds to transfer, or facilitate the transfer of, the F-35 to Turkey “until the Secretary of State certifies…that the Government of Turkey is not purchasing the S-400 missile defense system from Russia and will not accept the delivery of such system.” Unlike the NDAA, this amendment would immediately block funding for the transfer of F-35 until DoD can certify that Turkey will not receive the S-400. Thus far, Ankara has shown no indication that it will forgo the S-400 purchase.

    Jeg skjønner ikke helt det amerikanske systemet -- hva må til for at Senator Hollens "amendment" skal bli gyldig og trå i kraft? Hvis det skjer så er det en voldsom opptrapping. Tyrkia skal jo motta S-400 neste år!

  23. #983
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    Sv: Fokus: Tyrkia - høyt politisk spill med NATO og kurderne - Europa

    Erdogan viser ingen tegn til å snu, han virker fast bestemt på å kjøpe S-400, og ser ut til at han er villig til å ofre F-35 hvis nødvendig!?

    https://www.reuters.com/article/us-t...-idUSKCN1LG0X8

    Tyskland sier at Tyrkia må frigi tyske fanger før forholdet kan normaliseres. Det er fortsatt 50 tyske fanger/gisler i tyrkisk fangeskap etter kuppforsøket:

    https://www.reuters.com/article/us-e...-idUSKCN1LG209

    Tyske myndigheter har kuttet støtte til den største Tyrkisk/islamske organisasjonen i Tyskland etter flere skandaler:

    In another scandal, DITIB imams reportedly called on worshippers to pray for a Turkish military victory against Syrian Kurds in Afrin.

    DITIB again came under fire in April for holding a military re-enactment involving Turkish flags and fake guns handed to child "martyrs."

    Last year, DITIB controversially refused to take part in an anti-terrorism march in Cologne.

    "Those who spread nationalism, hatred of Christians, Jews or people of no religious affiliation and spy here at the behest of the Turkish government cannot be a partner in the fight against religious extremism in Germany," Christoph de Vries, a spokesman for Chancellor Angela Merkel's Christian Democrats (CDU) on internal affairs, told Bild newspaper on Thursday.
    https://www.dw.com/en/germany-cuts-f...tib/a-45297763

    Det ser mer og mer ut til at Tyrkia ikke lengre vil være en del av "vesten", men velger å gå sin egen vei. Forsåvidt greitt nok, hvis det virkelig er det de vil.

    Men forstår de fullt ut at det vil ha store konsekvenser? Man kan ikke få både i pose og sekk... Vet ikke om Tyrkerne helt har skjønt det??

    Kanskje på tide å diskutere om Tyrkia bør være med i NATO også i framtida...?

  24. #984
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    Sv: Fokus: Tyrkia - høyt politisk spill med NATO og kurderne - Europa

    Sitat Opprinnelig skrevet av loke2 Vis post
    https://stockholmcf.org/commentary-n...-trojan-horse/

    ????

    Kan noen bekrefte at ovenstående er en vill konspirasjonsteori!?
    Ja. På det store hele. Han klin kokos Perincek har noen få venner i forsvaret, men å tro at det Tyrkiske forsvaret er kontrollert av en liten sekt av ultra nasjonalistiske sosialister som drømmer om at Tyrkia skal bli BFF med Russland, det er en konspirasjonsteori. De eks-militære som ble dømt i ulike skinprosesser når Erdogan og Gūlen var allierte, har hvis dem har engasjert seg politisk i all hovedsak gjort det i CHP som er det viktigste opposisjonen partiet i Tyrkia. En del også IYI som er et annet opposisjonsparti.

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  25. #985
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    Sv: Fokus: Tyrkia - høyt politisk spill med NATO og kurderne - Europa

    En liten bildequiz
    Hvilket land?
    Når?
    Hvilke to militærmakter er representert på bildet?
    Hvem på bildet er idag en viktig aktør i Syria?

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